MJ calls what happened to her in Zion national park “small ‘T’ trauma”. She knows women have experienced worse from their partners. But she still feels the anger of being left behind on a hike by her now ex. “It brings up stuff in my body that maybe I have not cleared out yet,” she said.
Five years ago, MJ and a new partner – he was not exactly her boyfriend, and the pair were not exclusive – traveled from Los Angeles to Utah for an adventure getaway. MJ, who is 38 and works in PR, was looking forward to exploring Zion’s striking scenery; its vast sandstone canyon and pristine wading trails were on the list. But on the morning of their big hike, MJ was not feeling well. She could not shake the feeling that something was “off”; indeed, MJ would learn on this trip that her partner was seeing other women.
As they made their way up Angel’s Landing, MJ’s partner started walking faster than her. “I could tell it was getting on his nerves that I was slow,” she said. “I was like, ‘Fuck it, just go ahead of me.’” He did without hesitation.
When she caught up at the top of the mountain, they took a picture together. Then her partner hiked down the mountain with a woman he had met on the way up, leaving MJ to finish by herself. They broke up shortly after that trip. (MJ asked to be referred to by her initials for the sake of speaking openly about a past relationship.)
Last month, MJ opened TikTok and heard the phrase “alpine divorce”, a label she now attaches to her experience in Zion.
And some men wonder why some women would choose a bear.
TBF bears are pretty great. Bears probably win over women, too.
A bear would totally run away and abandon you on a hiking trail. No difference there.
Speaking from experience.
*results may vary in Montana, Wyoming, Idaho, and Alaska.
I would choose a teddy bear over any human in the woods.
Women need to stop putting their faith in shitty men.
shitty men are more attractive than not shitty men, because shitty men are willing to do whatever it takes to get the girl, and then dump her on a mountain top.
shitty men are also really good at hiding how shitty they are, until they stop hiding it… and what a more perfect place to stop hiding it, than in the middle of no where with few witnesses.
so are shitty women.
most shitty people aren’t going to be shitty in public, they wait until you are in a vulnerable moment.
most shitty people aren’t going to be shitty in public, they wait until you are in a vulnerable moment.
Yeah they do. Ive known abuse from a few different, expierences, and it is always covert abuse. Kind people in front of others, mean/cruel behind closed doors. That how it can go on for so long and people can get trapped in these kinds of relationships. Sucks.
Yes, and it’s how you get gaslit. Because everyone else thinks they are so wonderful, so if you think there is an issue, it must be you that is problematic one…
people focus way way too much on superficial bullshit. I had a few friends who fell into that trap and had super abusive partners, and I myself fell into it, thankfully not as badly though. And the abusers frame the entire think as your fault. If only you’d listen to them and make them happy, then they wouldn’t’ have to hit you…
Lmao, I think most shitty people tend to be pretty fucking obvious. That’s sort of why people have common red flags. Like not dating people who talk down to others or who badmouth servers or who vote Republican. Because those warning signs don’t usually come out of nowhere, but I will grant that sometimes, rarely, shitty people do hide themselves.
I don’t think they are obvious at all.
God forbid shitty men are told to be less shitty.
They’re told that all the time and they don’t listen or care because they are shitty.
Everyone who rewards their shitty behavior encourages it.
As does everyone who ignores their shitty behaviour.
I will say that us women get pretty fucking tired of often being the only ones to speak up tho.
Yes. We really need more men to call each other out for this shit.
But somehow, all of the messaging to convince men to raise the floor have somehow been received as an attack on manhood when in reality, the results would benefit both men and women immensely.
Equality looks like oppression to men because they benefit from how society is now. They don’t care that women are blamed for how they act, they want to continue to oppress women for their own gain.
I feel like men teaching other men to grieve “losses” of male advantages is just one of many tactics used to spread anti-equality attitudes.
But yes, I agree. Many see “removal of unfair advantage” as “losing” instead of “rebalancing.” Not sure why you are getting downvoted for it.
Because I’ve pissed off some of the men in this thread and they’ve gone through and downvoted a lot of my comments. Meh.
I feel like men teaching other men to grieve “losses” of male advantages is just one of many tactics used to spread anti-equality attitudes.
Well said
We really need more men to call each other out for this shit.
It’s complete hypocrisy to direct this criticism at men specifically, given things like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3PgH86OyEM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEZH6YSQvwAReturn to reality. For one thing, the bystander effect is gender-neutral, so encouraging people to speak up when they witness mistreatment of others, regardless of the sex of either the perpetrator, the victim, or the witness, is inarguably positive. But singling out the sex that is demonstrably most likely to intervene when the opposite sex is witnessed being mistreated, as if males are the only ones that need to be ‘called out’ for non-intervention, does nothing but expose an extremely-obvious bias.
You need to teach each other how to recognize these predators so you stop falling prey to their tactics.
Personally, I don’t hang around shitbags so I don’t have an opportunity to tell them what they’re doing is wrong in any way that might matter to them. I’ve been saying this guy is trash this entire time.
What do you think the purpose of sharing stories like in the article is?
But men are very upset in here that women are talking about these stories. That it doesn’t happen enough for women to talk about it. That it’s sexist to share stories of the type of men who take these actions.
Women share stories, women gossip, women look out for each other in these ways all the time. We have to work together to protect ourselves from predatory men all the time.
Golly gee, thank you SO FUCKING MUCH for telling us that we need to teach each other. How would us silly women have ever thought of that if YOU didn’t tell us?
A person can do both. But my words of don’t be shitty won’t carry as much weight as them not getting laid. So both is a far more effective choice then only one.
I will also add two more. Women should stop having babies with shitty men, as they don’t teach thier sons not to be shitty, and men who get women pregnant need to step up and make sure thier son’s don’t grow up to be shitty men.Yes yes, it’s all women’s fault that men are shitty. Thanks for enlightening me!
So saying both can be true now equals only one is true? I guess 2 + 2 = 5 as well.
Articles like this are 99% trash
So are some comments.
So two or three “credible” stories over a century qualify for this headline? Seems a bit inflated.
I mean… it’s not a nice thing to do to someone but… eh…
I’d agree, and this sounds more of a failure of communication and expectation setting from the get go, from both parties.
Why would the woman in the story have to express that she expects her partner to hike with her the whole time?
Edit: Who are all you men who think that it’s acceptable to abandon your hiking partner while on a hike?? What the fuck is happening here?
Because it obviously wasn’t clear to her partner. Instead of assuming, communicate. Women do this often and yes I’m generalizing but men aren’t mind readers. Different people will have different expectations unless you talk and agree.
How is it not clear that when planning a hike where there is only 2 people, that the assumption is those 2 people stay together unless there’s an emergency?
That’s the whole issue here, right? Why are these men deciding on their own that they no longer want to hike with these women and are abandoning them on the mountain? Why didn’t these men communicate with their partner?
You are again assuming. It’s obvious you shouldn’t. The confusion is your own.
Why didn’t these men communicate to their partner that they no longer wanted to hike with them?
What is everyone’s problem with women sharing these stories though? We’re not allowed to speak about these instances because you decided it doesn’t happen frequently enough?
I think sharing is fine, and the actions of these boys are deplorable. But the story makes it out to be a major trend, instead of just sharing the stories. And to me, that is likely to make it happen more often, not less. So that bothers me.
“Shhhh don’t talk about abuse you’ve suffered because it might bring more abuse”
Do you ever look yourself in the mirror? You keep misrepresenting what other people are saying and being an ass, but in another comment you complain it’s impossible to have a conversation with someone because they are being scornful.
I’m guessing this is why you have a new account; probably banned a lot for being a dick.
I was thinking the same. Some people just enjoy a fight. Triggers adrenaline and such. I do feel bad for them that they don’t have better ways to get happy feels.
That’s not what I’m saying. Don’t make it about something it’s not.
If something happens a handful of times… it’s barely a story.
That’s literally what your comment is saying - that this type of abuse doesn’t happen enough to warrant attention. Why do you have a problem with women sharing stories like this?
Apparently you can’t read.
Apparently you can’t write lol
So two or three “credible” stories over a century qualify for this headline? Seems a bit inflated.
I mean… it’s not a nice thing to do to someone but… eh…
Care to elaborate? Because you are clearly expressing that this doesn’t happen enough for people to actively talk about it.
So…
They weren’t in an exclusive relationship.
She told him to walk ahead without her.
And he talked to someone else since she told him not to walk with her, someone he seems to have met while waiting for her at the summit before going down.
Kind of sounds like she broke off a situationship on a hike. And immediately assumed if he talked to any woman then he was romantically interested in her, so their open relationship was never going to work anyways.
Even the actual alpine one where the woman was left in a blizzard recently and died, her parents have come out and said the infantilizing of their daughter was an insult to her memory.
Like, it should be a safe bet that anything that starts on TimToknis bullshit.
But yeah, big outdoorsy trips aren’t for rocky relationships. Romantic or otherwise you need to be going with people you trust. Shit can get stressful and not everyone reacts well to stress. It’s not the same thing as the same distance walk thru the park.
You seem to be making a lot of assumptions there.
No, I just read the article…
What app/frontend do you use? It seems most people are missing the feature to open the source to read.
Yeah that situation seemed defensible on his part. But then the article comes in and outright says that in a lot of these cases it’s a failure of communication where the men aren’t thinking about it like that and in hindsight realized that they’d made a mistake.
That all said, I find it difficult to be sympathetic to these guys as someone who likes to hike with her wife. Even if I was annoyed she wasn’t able to keep up with me I can’t imagine ditching her even if she told me to. When I go hiking with someone or a group one of the major rules is that you never leave the weakest hiker alone unless it’s an emergency. You stick together and enjoy each other’s company
Wife is quite a different magnitude of commitment, in comparison to a non-exclusive non-girlfriend partner.
Doesn’t mean it’s ok to abandon your hiking partner whilst on the hike.
Like seriously, you think that it’s ok to treat someone terribly on a hike as long as they’re only a casual partner?
If they say you can go on ahead, it depends how well you know the other person.
The people I hike with, if they say that to me, I take them at their word. Maybe they would feel happier and more relaxed, if they hike at their own pace. It’s not abandonment, It is communication.
Some people get really anxious if they don’t go for the summit or objective right away and some people like me prefer to go more slowly and take their time. It doesn’t make sense to me to force both people into a compromise if you’d be happier walking your own hike.
If somebody said it and didn’t mean it, that’s something different. Or maybe they meant it, but they’re inexperienced, and would regret actually being left to hike on their own. That’s also something different.
One thing that you never do though is to hike past a trail juncture without waiting for your partner to catch up. But I guess even then, if you’ve been on the same hike multiple times and you have a plan for where you’re going to meet back up, even that is okay.
No question. But on the spectrum of basic decency, the minimum you owe to another group member from the get-go is as @captainlezbian@lemmy.world laid out; you stick together.
You’re over here saying it’s a bare minimum assumption that group members stick together on a hike while simultaneously telling me in another conversation that it’s the woman’s fault for not communicating that she expected them to hike together?
Are you fucking serious?
As far as I know, that particular hike is very popular and very very safe though
What? No it isn’t. This isn’t about personal relationships, it’s about responsibility during a dangerous hike.
By the way: this particular hike is very very very safe.
So like, some lady I’m on an early date with? Yeah no different in general rule. If I take you into a situation that you aren’t individually comfortable in I’m an asshole for ditching you there alone, even if we decide we hate each other in the meantime
Putting in that the woman in the story assumed her partner was romantically interested in the gal he met at the top that he climbed back down with is absolutely making assumptions. That kind of assumption is not in the article and you’re framing it as if she was being irrational.
As they made their way up Angel’s Landing, MJ’s partner started walking faster than her. “I could tell it was getting on his nerves that I was slow,” she said. “I was like, ‘Fuck it, just go ahead of me.’” He did without hesitation.
When she caught up at the top of the mountain, they took a picture together. Then her partner hiked down the mountain with a woman he had met on the way up, leaving MJ to finish by herself
Both her and the author thought it was important to note that it was gasp a woman that he talked to.
There’s a logical implication for why they both thought that was important enough to be included when retelling the story.
Saying that someone’s implication might not be true isn’t the same as making an assumption.
It’s literally the opposite…
You’re literally making an assumption.
Neither the author nor MJ said he was romantically interested in the other woman.
So then it’s not a big deal he talked to someone else after his date told him to leave her?
And he’s a good guy for ensuring she made it safely to the top before returning?
Like, what exactly do you think that guy did wrong then?
Because logically I have zero idea what you’re doing.
It’s a big deal that he started with a hiking partner and then abandoned her. It’s rude.
And hellesbelle was correct when they said you were making a lot of assumptions here.
he was not exactly her boyfriend, and the pair were not exclusive
her partner was seeing other women.
So she had a double standard. Then surprisepikachu’s when she tells him to go ahead and he does. Lol
Even casual partners will want to know if their partner is sleeping with others for a variety of reasons.
As they made their way up Angel’s Landing, MJ’s partner started walking faster than her. “I could tell it was getting on his nerves that I was slow,” she said. “I was like, ‘Fuck it, just go ahead of me.’” He did without hesitation.
He kept pushing ahead and going faster than she could, what else was she supposed to do besides tell him to go on ahead?
Both of these people seem like shitbags so it’s not surprising they both do shitty things to each other.
Wow what an insughtful and balanced take. It must be true because your position is in the middle of two arbitrary extremes. Why didn’t I think of that!
I would argue you shouldn’t give the person trying to do something bad exactly what they want
I agree with you. It just gives them plausible deniability. Better to communicate clearly. “Stop walking so fast. I can’t keep up. I don’t feel comfortable being left behind. In fact, if you leave me behind, I’ll start a TikTok trend to shame you.”
These men that abandon their partner on hikes because they can’t properly express their own feelings should be publicly shamed.
If I’m with a man who is clearly pissed off, im not going to insist he stay with me if he doesn’t want to. That’s more dangerous than being on a hike alone for a woman.
Ok fair tbh
Tell him to wait for you. You don’t abandon your hiking partners.
Still trying really hard to make this situation the woman’s fault, hm?
It’s a real struggle in that situation - do you insist that the man you’re with who is visibly frustrated and physically stronger than you wait? Or do you give him what he wants which is to push ahead and leave you?
This is why women choose the bear.
It’s both of their faults. She chose a piece of shit and he is a piece of shit.
Women need to learn how to protect themselves from scumbags if they want to stop being taken advantage by them.
Unfortunately, I guarantee the women he switched to will not learn from the previous ones’ mistakes. They’re just going to be glad it’s their turn, lol.
Your portrayal of the woman in this story is wildly inconsistent. Reflect on why you keep changing your views to make what happened her fault.
Not really. I’ve been consistent this entire time.
As usual, you people need to twist your brains into knots to find ways not to blame a woman.
Did you read the article? What about the guy who refused a rescue helicopter and left his partner on top of a mountain alone to die without even using the blanket? Surely that’s the woman’s fault somehow?
What part of “you don’t abandon your hiking partner” was unclear to you
What part of that was within the woman’s control?
None, which is why I’m confused about why you think I’m blaming her.
“Tell him to wait for you.”
That’s the sentence where you’re putting the onus on the woman to tell her partner to wait for her.
He should do that already.
MJ and a new partner – he was not exactly her boyfriend, and the pair were not exclusive…[MJ] could not shake the feeling that something was “off”; indeed, MJ would learn on this trip that her partner was seeing other women.
This is like saying you agreed to go dutch on a date, and then feeling that something was “off” because you couldn’t shake the feeling he was intending to split the bill.
No shit?
Damn what a cowardly way to dump someone. Is it really that much of a pain in the ass to stick it out for a couple of days until you’re not literally abandonning someone somewhere they didn’t expect to be alone? Bunch of douchy and selfabsorbed asshats.
Some people, not anyways men, have been taught, rather mercilessly, that they have to be self sufficient. These people get aggravated, even angry when someone else fails to live up to the standard that they (unfairly) were forced to. There can be an instinctive feeling that it is somehow an injustice to them.
That doesn’t excuse abandoning someone in the wilderness. Often these people struggle to learn to be a kind helper.
Also, none of this is meant to excuse the behavior. It is possible to understand “why” without condoning it. When confronting this it is important to be firm that it is unacceptable, as well as understanding that it may be a struggle to relearn.
Co-opting alpine divorce, which regularly involves a murder attempt, feels weird? Just call it the sierra split.
I do wonder how much of this is a cheapening of the weekend getaway, where you’d go to a B&B upstate, find out your potential partner snores, drinks to much, is rude to service workers, or views a toothbrush as optional. You’d sigh and split. It’s just a bad weekend.
But with this, camping and hiking is a complication. You’re drinking warm filtered water from a Nalgene, eating granola because someone forgot to bring a lighter. Also, it’s raining and all your socks are wet. Did you bring anything to wash dishes? Ah, there are no dishes. You smell like smoke and are covered in sand.
Granted, you can do camping/hiking well, but I’d bet some of these cases are from people doing it poorly, trying to save a buck by avoiding more expensive weekend getaways.
I don’t care who you are, you should never go to a place with someone that you are not capable of leaving alone.
Remind me never to get on an airplane or train.
Buses questionable.
When you get on a plane, they do a whole safety announcement, pointing out the exits. Trains and busses have legally mandated labeling for exits. You are well informed how to get out on your own.
Yeah for planes I’m not worried about how to use the door, I’m worried about how I get from 20 000+ feet to ground level, safely.
For trains and buses it’d be more about hiking out from the middle of nowhere.
Either case I’m not actually worried, just saying that the logic of “trust no one but yourself” is flawed.
It’s less about trusting no one and more about recognizing that something could happen to the person you are with, like a medical emergency for example, and that you should be able to survive on your own. Say you are hiking with someone and they fall and break their leg. Do you both just lay there and die? You need to be able to get yourself back to safety and to get help.
So should everyone bring their own rope/tent/boat/… to any activity where they are usually shared?
How about activities where noone can safely leave on their own?“A man is not a plan”
I’m just gonna say it, if you want to break up with your girlfriend don’t be a dick about it.
“Don’t go on a hike with someone you don’t trust.” All you little boys in here victim blaming need to be checked.
The amount and stuntedness of emotionally stunted immature men is only going up with social media…everything
Got back into the dating world recently and was pretty surprised to learn that respectfully communicating your feelings about things afterwards is apparently rare. People need to grow up.
Ever since social media took over, dating and relationship rates have plummeted.
what so hard about breaking over a text even, even if its a little insensitive.
Balanced take. This kind of thing is very veryserious. But also a dilution of the term Alpine Divorce, which people have died from.
Any of these women in the stories could have died while alone on a hike. That’s sort of the point.
But it is also not true that they were at risk? Any more than you could die anywhere.
You don’t think it’s more dangerous out in the wilderness than walking an aisle in a Target?
I disagree that a popular trail with many people can be called wilderness, but I would be okay calling it a backcountry location.
There are not too many things that can harm you on such a trail compared to another comparable physical activity, like playing soccer on a field for instance. The main difference is that it is harder to get to definitive care if you do get hurt.
On the soccer field, the ambulance pulls up in 5-10 minutes when you sprain an ankle or get stung by a bee and your airway closes up. On the hike, ideally you splint yourself and walk out if you roll your ankle, And do anything you can if you get that bee sting and have a life-threatening anaphylaxis, including call 911, lie down flat on your back, take bandadryls if you have them, and use your epipan if you have it.
But in both these cases you’re never really alone because there are so many other people. And on the trail, there’s probably a higher chance of encountering somebody with first aid training than on the soccer field.
To be honest, I’m not sure what exactly the context of your question was, but I assume it has something to do with leaving somebody to hike alone on these popular trails like angel falls or delicate arch in general.
In the specific example of the article, I don’t think it was a super big deal that the original person left her to go home with another woman, because she didn’t seem too much in danger, just emotionally hurt. She even told him to go on and hike ahead of her. In the worst case, there are plenty other people who would help her if she were to roll an ankle, have car trouble, or something. And she had cell service the whole time. To me, this isn’t that different than getting up and leaving somebody in the middle of a jog in a nice neighborhood that you arrived at separately, if you had a fight with them. The biggest difference being the response time of EMS.
From reading these other comments, though, a lot of people seem to feel like being left alone on a hike would be more stressful than being left alone in the front country, which I don’t really understand, but I can accept that people would feel like that. I would hate to be abandoned at a party or at a bar, for instance – It’s not somewhere I’m comfortable at all. And I’d much rather walk back to my car alone on a popular well marked trail in the daytime.
The example of the woman at Delicate Arch is more confusing since it seems she actually was having a medical issue of some kind giving her vertigo. I don’t think the two should have separated in that case, but it’s really hard to decipher what actually happened in that situation, Especially having just one side of the story.
The example that involved the woman dying in the mountains is wildly different to me. I really don’t like how much male ego the guy seems to have in that he had abandoned previous partner on a different trip and how he had declined a helicopter rescue for both of them when they were first in trouble. In my opinion, he killed the person he was with by doing that.
There seems to be no world to me in which the situation on the angel falls trail is at all comparable to the gross negligence in that last example.
I live in an area that is densely wooded and has many, many hiking trails of various difficulty. It is always taught here that you need to be aware and ready for danger on any hiking trail, no matter how popular.
Wild animals and falls are absolutely a thing that makes being in the wilderness more dangerous than say a soccer field as you used for an example.
I don’t think it’s ever ok to leave a hiking partner except in cases of emergency when there’s only 2 people in the group and especially not because one of those people is being a jerk and won’t explain why or what they’re feeling or want to do. The lack of communication from the men in these situations outlined by the article is astounding especially for those situations.
I think we will have to agree to disagree on some points due to different backgrounds. On extremely crowded trails near me, danger from wildlife is just not common where I’m from. If I was in California, maybe I would have to worry about mountain lions, but even they do not like crowds, so I’m not sure what wild animals you are considering a risk. I think probably the most risky animal would be something you could get a bee sting and anaphylaxis from, which would be more dangerous in the back country, I agree. But it doesn’t seem significantly different if you are hiking alone and the person right behind you calls 911 in 20 seconds when they reach you, or if the person right next to you calls 911.
Some trails have fall potential and some don’t. It would be a very different thing to leave somebody to attempt half dome on their own versus a nice hike in the woods, even when going up to a pleasant summit.
I’ve heard kayakers say never boat alone, but where I live at least the same thing is not true for hiking, mountain biking or even rock climbing for that matter. Maybe that’s a rule of thumb in your area that just doesn’t exist here. I would definitely never ever swim alone, though. The common training here for hikers is to carry the ten outdoor essentials even on easy hikes, and practice leave no trace, including step 1: Always let somebody know where you’re going and when you’ll come back.
To me the biggest issue here is communication. If I was expecting to meet my hiking partner back at the car, but when I got there they had driven off already, I would be really miffed, not knowing what happened. It would be even worse if their car was there, but they were not there.
On the other hand, if they told me, hey, I’ve got to leave early, I’m going to head back to the trailhead now, and I said, okay, fine, I’ll see you next time and finish the hike on my own. I don’t see any problem doing that. To me, there’s no set in-stone rule against hiking alone, the way there is for swimming alone or boating alone, because it is just not as risky, and, in fact, is quite routine. That’s why it’s hard for me to call most back country areas near me ‘wilderness’, because they are so close to civilization, so dominated by human impacts that there is just so little added risk that you wouldn’t have in the front country.
I’m referring to bears, wolves, coyotes, and wildcats primarily. California is similar. There’s large swaths of the US that are still very much wilderness even if there is a human population nearby.
So yes, perhaps our different perspectives is what is putting us at such odds over what a big deal this is. I would be very upset at a man who is visibly pissed off at me but won’t communicate and keeps pushing ahead of me without saying what he wants.
I know this isn’t really the same, but the article struck a chord with me and the experiences I have with my fiance. She convinced me to buy and play Arc Raiders. (It’s an extraction shooter.) This isn’t the type of game I normally play. I am not good. She made a run for an extraction point, and didn’t wait for me to be in the elevator before pressing the button to extract, leaving me stranded with the enemy everywhere. (She’s run way ahead of me in game before and I’ve taken issue with it and explained I feel abandoned when she runs way ahead without me.) The last time we played, I happened to make it to the elevator before her, and I made a point to say, “are you in the elevator,” before pressing the god damned button.
Obviously, I wasn’t in real danger, but those experiences have made me wary of depending on her.
As you said no danger in your situation but it seems like your fiancee had the same mindset as the hikers (inpatience and disregard for other persons wellbeing).
Lots of people have that mindset. Regardless of the relationship. And lots of hikers have total disdain for anyone who is slower or less experienced than them. I had one hiking date where the woman was pissed off at me that I was not as fatigued as her, because she was more experienced, but I was fitter than she was, and she kept warning and lecturing me about how I better not fall behind her. She also lectured me on my poor gear choices.
Then afterwards she changed her tune about how ‘impressed’ she was that I was as good at hiking as she was. Least to say I stopped seeing her shortly thereafter because of her need to constantly condescend about everything. She was French, so maybe it was just a cultural thing.
Book that therapy appointment. You’re obsessing over ex-girlfriends again.
Exactly why I started refusing to play video games with my ex-husband.
Some of these comments are absolutely disgusting, many of you guys desperately need to talk to a therapist. If you read a story like this and feel the need to defend your gender identity, you have some deep-seated insecurity which you should take seriously before it starts harming your relationships with others. I am saying this as a man who had deep-seated insecurity which took a heavy toll on my relationships before seeking years of therapy. It’s not as expensive as it sounds, I promise, and it could totally change your life for the better.
+1
I’m honestly ashamed of my sex.
I get it, I’ve witnessed guys have gut wrenching experiences with women, but… come, on. Do y’all have to internalize that as misogyny?
what if my therapist helped me identify that it was my unreliable girlfriends who were the problem in the relationship, and not myself, and helped me stop dating people who were seeking to exploit me through emotional manipulation and victim-framing narratives rather than taking accountability for their own choices?
and after that my life improved immensely and my family and other relationships grew?
I’m really glad to hear that therapy helped you, thank you for sharing that - I hope that helps other men who have similar struggles as you to take the plunge and get the help they need.
On a personal note, though, I just had a quick look at your comments and honestly, it feels like you still have a lot of unresolved issues here that you’d benefit from getting off your chest in a safe environment, so I’d suggest more therapy. I’m sorry that people have hurt you, and that isn’t your fault, but if you continue to let it dominate your life, it will hurt you in ways that you’ll never really understand.
Much love & solidarity.
Right, because you are clearly a therapist and my comments that you find disagreeable clearly mean I have unresolved issues… because if I was ‘healthy’ I’d be in full agreement with you, right? It can’t be there are multiple legitimate viewpoints and people have difference experiences. Nope.
You piss and moan about men, but I doubt you self-reflect enough to ask yourself why it is you have to shame and belittle others if you are such a ‘secure’ individual. Probably because you are still massively insecure and intolerant of anyone who doesn’t share your views on gender and you are projecting your ‘redemption narrative’ onto everyone else.
To me your post reads like someone who is desperately virtue signaling they are ‘one of the good guys!’ I’m sure plenty of your exes would disagree.
And the irony of my experience is that your reply, is ALWAYS the one I get for sharing my experiences. ‘oh no if women hurt you you clearly are forever in need of therapy forever because you can’t ever move on if you mention it’. As it isn’t a massive the issue with men isn’t that they are constantly and endlessly shamed and dehumanized the second they express negative experiences with women. It’s always their fault and their burden to never be publicly expressed.
Apparently I’m only ‘healed’ if I only ever talk about women as as victims of male abuse… never the fact that many women are awful people, because women are just people like men and both men and women are objects and subjects of abusive behaviors.
I’m not shaming or belittling you, I applaud you for seeking out therapy and I encourage you to continue to do so.
Can I ask what made you consider therapy in the first place?
Some of these comments are absolutely disgusting, many of you guys desperately need to talk to a therapist. If you read a story like this and feel the need to defend your gender identity, you have some deep-seated insecurity which you should take seriously before it starts harming your relationships with others
No, you are shaming and belittling men.
And now you are trying to cast aspirtions that my ‘therapy’ is fake and false because it didn’t lead to the same conclusion as yours. Just like the idiots I meet who tell me if I am not in life-long therapy I must be emotionally damaged… which always comes from people who have spent their life in therapy never resolving their own issues. Project, project, project.
Your feelings are valid, and I apologise if it came across that way, I definitely could have worded it better. It’s okay to be insecure, there’s nothing there to be ashamed of, as I wrote in my own post, I struggled a lot with insecurity myself.
Post-edit reply: I’m not saying anything disparaging about your theraputic journey - again I applaud you for doing it, and I encourage you to continue. I think that’s really healthy. But you have to realize, that what you’re doing here, is you are taking something I wrote, which wasn’t aimed at you, personally - that’s a classic sign of an insecure person, right? Again, no shame there, I want to help you become the best version of yourself that you can be.
Nah I’m calling you out on your sexist commentary that men need therapy if they doubt some bullshit rage bait article that is trying to claim all men are plotting to abandon their girlfriends on the tops of mountains, based on one lady’s teary eyed tiktok vid.
The entire thing is absurd and manufactured to illicit outrage based on forced gender generalizations, and lots of folks here and eating it up. All you have to do is make the story a gay couple, or a non-romantic relationship, and the entire thing would collapse.
Do you think it would be as equally as ‘outrageous’ if it was a gay couple?
You should book another therapy session because you still obsess over those ex girlfriends daily.
Two people, can just not be right for eachother. It’s okay to date someone and not have it not work out.
Totally. But that’s not often how people see things when they are emotionally charged or the relationship was fraught from the start. And a lot of people engage in self-fulling prophecies or self-destructive behaviors. Many people only pursue relationships they know are going to fail, for example.
You also can try to break up with someone and have them physically attack you and stalk you for weeks later and they don’t back off until you threaten them with legal/police action. You never know how people are going to react.
This is true. It took me three years one time to get rid of, a well, we will call a pest. Three years. Aweful. I don’t harbor any hate to them anymore though, Ive healed and found myself.
But, as Im trying to teach my young son right now, we can’t control what other people do or say, we can only control how we respond to it. Noting, there is a big differene in reacting, and responding. Lessons I wish I got as a kid ya know? Its good stuff.
