Donald Trump has said that Palestinians have “no alternative” but to leave Gaza due to the devastation left by Israel’s war on Hamas, in effect endorsing ethnic cleansing of the territory over the opposition of Palestinians and the neighbouring countries.
Speaking as he prepared to host Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, on Tuesday, Trump repeated the suggestion that Gaza’s population should be relocated to Jordan and Egypt – something both countries have firmly rejected.
Trump claimed Palestinians would “love to leave Gaza”, telling reporters: “I would think that they would be thrilled.”
So beyond fighting about what happened in 2024… What are you going to do about it?
Are you calling your senators? Representatives? Federal level? State level? Governor?
Even if you live in a red state, you can be annoying. Leave voicemails. Ask for call backs. Write letters. Blue state - better. Cmon, they’re spineless. Shout louder than everyone else.
Then look for local issues. Local manifestations of fascism that are small enough for you to do something about. Show up to city council and school board (there have been lots of efforts to overtake these smaller bodies too.) Community organizing for Palestine could also be community organizing for addressing attacks on the homeless, women’s autonomy, etc.
For Palestine or for women’s autonomy…pick one.
Removed by mod
Wow it’s almost like this was predictable. Good thing all those liberals who didn’t vote for Harris could not have possibly known Trump would be even worse…
Leftist progressives refused to vote for Harris. Let’s not whitewash events from less than a month ago.
Many people used her wishy washy stance on Palestine to justify why they didn’t vote for her.
The majority may have been “leftist progressives”, I dunno. But the issue they were claiming to vote against is the issue.
lets not confuse not voting for, and voting aganst
Unless you’re being foolish, by election day they are the same thing.
Did any of the Palestinians ever regret all those kidnappings? It brought so much suffering, yet no word of regret and still some hostages remain.
Eat shit, you sadistic monster
So, I am a sadistic monster for pointing out that kidnapping civilists and meístreating them instead of just getting rid of your extremist leaders led to the desaster. And not even showing regret and distancing yourself from those religious zealots doesn’t help, of course. But I am the monster, not the kidnappers. How dillusional are you???
If your reaction to this is to whine about the US internal politics you’re a heartless piece of shit. My dead friends aren’t political stakes for a bunch of american who only care about themselves and their stupid elections.
I’m truly sorry for your loss.
I’d ask protest voters if they’re feeling pretty stupid right now, but the truth is they never gave a flying fuck about Palestinians. They only cared about feeling morally superior.
Trash humans.
Yeah, because Kamala was so pro-palestine lmfao. The democrat party’s policy was literally “maybe we’ll support genocide a little less than the other guys. Maybe.”
Like, any sane party would have seen how polling showed that a huge chunk of your base rejected your stance on Palestine and reevaluated. But nope, Dems went full steam ahead with it.
Like goddamn, you’re here calling other people trash because they didn’t want to support a candidate who was okay giving a blank check to a foreign country earmarked for carpet bombing civilians? Get over yourself jesus.
Yeah, because Kamala was so pro-palestine lmfao
What does that have to do with people who claimed they cared about Palestinians doing the right thing and voting for the BEST candidate regarding Palestine? Because Trump made it extremely clear he wanted Israel to steamroll Palestine and, oh shit, now that he’s president that’s the stance he’s taking. WHO COULD HAVE FORESEEN THIS!?!?!?!?
Honestly, you’re doing a great job of personifying the exact fools I’m talking about.
Like, any sane party would have seen how polling showed that a huge chunk of your base rejected your stance on Palestine and reevaluated.
You realize that a responsible government can’t just change its stance regarding allies every 4 years just to win an election, right? We would have no allies. It’ll be a cold day in hell before we jeopardize our most important ally in the Middle East. So are you suggesting Democrats should have stooped to Republican levels and lied to the American people by saying they would stop supporting Israel and then just taken that back after they won?
Like goddamn, you’re here calling other people trash because they didn’t want to support a candidate who was okay giving a blank check to a foreign country earmarked for carpet bombing civilians?
No, I’m here calling trash people trash for pretending they cared about Palestinians and then refusing to vote for the BEST AVAILABLE OUTCOME for Palestinians. I mean, I guess you could argue that they aren’t actually trash, but just really, really, super stupid people that somehow thought not voting for Palestinian’s best shot would be a smart thing to do. I’m willing to meet you in the middle on that one.
These dipshits sealed Palestinian’s fate AND put our own nation in extreme jeopardy. They can honestly go fuck themselves.
The amount of mental gymnastics you’re doing to justify the Democratic party supporting genocide is genuinely sad. And I do mean that, like it’s truly sad to me that so many people have convinced themselves that it’s a fine and normal thing that a nominally progressive party should support the wholesale slaughter of innocent people. I didn’t vote for that platform and I never will, because it’s truly, fundamentally evil. “Oh but it’s better then the other guy” so? I’m still voting to kill these people. I’d sooner not vote at all.
If Kamala had won, I absolutely guarantee you the overwhelming majority of Democrats would have conveniently forgotten how we were bankrolling these terrible crimes overseas.
The amount of mental gymnastics you’re doing to justify the Democratic party supporting genocide is genuinely sad.
The amount of mental gymnastics you’re doing to ignore the fact that these dipshits hurt Palestine more than they helped Palestine is genuinely sad.
I didn’t vote for that platform and I never will, because it’s truly, fundamentally evil.
Oh look, you’re one of those dipshits. You should go to Israel so they can personally thank you for helping elect Donald Trump.
I’d sooner not vote at all.
I’m trying to find out where your rock bottom is and I’m starting to think there isn’t one.
So noble that you don’t reject genocide on principle, only by if who does it is on your team or not
So noble that you don’t reject genocide on principle
This kind of shit is why adults can’t take you children seriously.
Do I actually have to type out the words “I AM AGAINST GENOCIDE” before you’re willing to allow your brain to take common sense into account?
Like, how slow do you have to be to not grasp that being against genocide and choosing Harris over Trump to minimize the fallout are not mutually exclusive?
Dipshits who sat out the election or voted 3rd party didn’t accomplish ANYTHING. They sat on the sidelines and cried like children while allowing the situation in Gaza to deteriorate to a maximum degree.
You’re the one who should feel stupid. You supported genocide out of pragmatism and you still lost.
your dogmatism did nothing to stop genocide either. we are both in hell.
Americans making this about Trump vs Kamala is getting really really annoying. I mean, we get it, you are pissed off at each other. We’ve read the same arguments dozens of times already, and at this point it is getting extremely tired. It sucks the oxygen out of every conversation. Is this what the discourse is going to be around Palestine and Israel the next four years?
You are commenting on an article specifically about Trump
The US President, yes. You have to understand that internationally, at this point, we just see him as just that: The US President. Your elections are your internal issue and we don’t need to be expending all our energy psychoanalyzing your electoral system. As not-an-american, I don’t give a damn about how mad you are at your fellow citizens who might or might not have stayed home at election day or voted in a way that you think was stupid. Not every fucking world event needs to be understood from the perspective of the role of Jill Fucking Stein as a spoiler candidate.
EDIT: Rule number 1 says “[…] Not United States Internal News […]”. This applies to posts, but I think after a certain point, overtly brigading every fucking world event thread with the internal US perspective kind of beats the point.
You should make this comment in a thread about Israel and Palestine vs in an article about Trump. It’s not making it about Trump to discuss Trump in an article about Trump.
That said its not our fault Israel is a clusterfuck. It’s a clusterfuck because of Palestinians and Israelis. Furthermore before it was Israel it was a British territory. The US is to schizophrenic and too morally weak to rely on to save anything. Save yourself or drown.
You should make this comment in a thread about Israel and Palestine vs in an article about Trump.
If this was /c/news you’d be right and I should not bother with this kind of comment, because then it would be about looking at this from the point of view of US politics. This is /c/world news. Trump is not a candidate that won your election, Trump is the sitting US president. Like, listen, if Trudeau says something stupid about Palestine, it would be ridiculous for a bunch of Canadians to brigade the thread and make it about how strategic NDP voters spoiled the last Canadian election. You would be complaining and you’d be right. If we were to go do that over at /c/canada, we’d be right to tell you off if you complain, but here in /c/world, you’d be right.
It’s not making it about Trump to discuss Trump in an article about Trump.
I didn’t say don’t make it about Trump. I said stop whining about your last election. We don’t care any more, it’s tired, and it’s stupid and I don’t fucking want to hear about how mad you are at Jill Stein or Kamala any more. If you want to whine about other Americans, go to /c/news and knock yourself out.
That said its not our fault Israel is a clusterfuck. It’s a clusterfuck because of Palestinians and Israelis. Furthermore before it was Israel it was a British territory.
That’s where you’re wrong, yank. It is your fault. Your country has been enabling the Israelis for the last 5 decades. They would not be able to do shit if you didn’t sell hand them over the weapons you do, if you didn’t play their big brother lawyer at every single fucking UN institution, vetoing every single fucking condemnation for every single fucking crime that they do. They wouldn’t be half as brazen if you were not doing everything possible to cover their asses at every single fucking opportunity you get. The Israelis are the primary culprit here, but the US is the reason why Israel keeps acting with complete fucking immunity and overwhelming power.
(“you” == your country, not you personally)
The US is to schizophrenic and too morally weak to rely on to save anything. Save yourself or drown.
We agree on that one.
This is world news but the thread is STILL about Trump specifically. If you don’t want to talk about Trump the logical thing would be to downvote such thread so you see less of them.
Talking about Trump does not mean talking about the election. Talking about Trump is talking about the US President.
The democrats were already funding billions of dollars worth of leopards in Gaza. This narrative that Muslims voted for this is disgusting when they really had no choice in the matter regardless of what a joke of a “democracy” we have pretends. Why do you think democrats refused to let them speak at the DNC?
This narrative that Muslims voted for this is disgusting when they really had no choice in the matter
Lol. They absolutely had a choice.
A shitty choice and a REAAAAAAALLY shitty choice are two different choices. They chose poorly.
A majority chose Jill Stein, the progressive candidate against genocide. A majority of them didn’t vote for Trump.
A majority chose Jill Stein
Jill Stein? You mean the clown that shows up a couple months out from every election, then disappears for 4 years? You mean the Jill Stein that got more votes than any other 3rd party candidate and that amounted to a whopping HALF OF A SINGLE PERCENT of the total votes cast by Americans?
That Jill Stein?
Lol. Anyone that voted 3rd party for president is a fool of the highest caliber. They threw their votes away on candidates that COULD NOT win, ensuring a Trump victory. Because every one of those fools went into the election not knowing if their vote for a 3rd party was going to be the deciding factor of the election.
Palestinians, Muslims, Blacks, Hispanics listen up. This is how much Democrats respect you. If you ever decide to not do exactly what they want, expect racist treatment from them like you see here. Might as well find a party that actually respects you & that won’t genocide you when it benefits them.
Hey at least the genocide will be over! Trump is so much better than Kamala on this!
Removed by mod
So…. Are both sides still the same? Asking for a friend.
Put the rhetoric aside, and the answer is yes. Israel stole a lot of land from Palestinians under both Democratic and Republican presidents and kept them under an oppressive apartheid system depriving them of their rights. Both parties vetoed UN resolutions to stop or even condemn the practice.
The Israeli government proposed annexing the West Bank in violation of international law, and while one president said he disagreed with the idea, he said he’d back Israel if they did. The other one said he’d support the idea and back Israel either way. Putting aside the rhetoric or intentions, the action is the same. That’s why Palestinians aren’t cheering when one party wins over another in US elections, because they saw what happened when republicans or democrats won; their situation didn’t change. If you feel otherwise, go visit and talk to them like I did.
Alright. So let’s assume for the moment that you’re right, and both parties would do exactly the same thing regarding Palestine. Just for the sake of argument.
Then they’re still not the same.
Would Kamala have handed entire departments of the U.S. government over to Musk? Would Kamala have signed a bazillion EO’s, taking away people’s rights? Would Kamala send thousands of people to Guantanamo? Would she have allowed ICE to raid schools or hospitals? Would she be systematically erasing transgender people from public life? Would Kamala be scrubbing databases and removing information (CDC for example), or making people waste time to delete certain terms from every database and website because of “woke” or “DEI”? Would Kamala have taken the U.S. out of the WHO? Or the Paris Agreement? Would Kamala be threatening to annex Greenland? Or start trade wars with allies? Or do petty shit like removing the option for regular Americans to file taxes for free online? Or pardon 1500+ violent idiots, at least 4 of whom have already been commiting new (and running from old) crimes? Would she install an antivaxer, who also promotes raw milk, to Health and Human Services? Or abolish the Department of Education?
Would she, would she, would she?
They. are. not. the. same.
And you repeating the same tired bullshit over and over and over will not suddenly make it true. You can try to convince yourself that what you did was the morally right thing, but in your own words: put aside the rhetoric and intentions. The consequences are on you.
But anyway, we both know that Kamala would not be the same regarding Gaza. Never would she have said she wants to “take over Gaza” and “own it” and to turn it into the “Riviera of the Middle East” to create “thousands of jobs.” She would never have proposed the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians.
Don’t get me wrong. I don’t think she would have done anything to actually help Palestinians, aside from some symbolic stuff or vague threats she will never act on. Somehow Americans seem to just love Israel, whatever horrific shit they pull, they’ll always side with Israel.
But “both sides are the same” is a blatant fucking lie.
This is a disingenuous argument. Republicans and Democrats are not the same EXCEPT ON PALESTINE. You’re beating a strawman.
The rest of it is arguments over rhetoric. Put the comments by Trump aside; in actuality if Netanyahu annexed West Bank or mass deported Gazans, Kamala and Trump would both continue to support Netanyahu financially and militarily even if they had different press releases ranging from concern to praise. Kamala refused to promise to enforce the Leahy Law and Trump isn’t either.
It’s not a strawman, it’s the truth.
Trump is orders of magnitude worse regarding pretty much everything, so even if Kamala is ‘the same’ on Palestine, all the other stuff would still be better with her in stead of Trump. If you truly believe they are the same regarding Palestine, then they basically cancel each other out, right? Then you should look at everything else and it’s quite obvious they are not the same at all.
Look, I don’t want to be the person who needs to boil things down to simple math. But don’t you think that “Fuck Palestine” is better than “Fuck Palestine. And transgender people. And women. And the environment. And the Department of Education. And migrants, and and and”?
Tell me, how is one not worse than the other?
You’re still strawmanning, because it’s no secret that Harris was better than Trump on literally every issue except Palestine. I admitted it above and you gloss over that so you can repeat the same thing as if you’re not listening. Trump is doing all the horrible things he promised he would do. You’re trying to blame me for this even though I wanted Trump to lose too. Peace.
No, what I am trying to point out is that all the people who kept repeating the “both sides”-bullshit actually HELPED Trump win. Repeat something often enough and idiots will believe it. I have no actual statistics about this, but I wonder, how many people eventually stayed home because they thought both sides are the same and voting wouldn’t matter anyway? How many people just sorta protest-voted Trump because they believed it wouldn’t make a difference anyway? How many people actually switched to third party voting because they initially wanted to, and it wouldn’t make a difference anyway?
Perpetuating this idea that Kamala was the same helped Trump win. It was repeated by certain people ad nauseam how Trump and Kamala were the same. How you shouldn’t vote for democrats because it would be voting for genocide. If they were the same, you’d end up with genocide either way, so then vote for the one who’s better on every other topic, no? But no, that’s not what they said. It was an intentional campaign to make people not vote for Kamala, either by staying home or voting Trump. Every single thread was full of “both sides”-trolls and 99% of those have mysteriously disappeared since Trump won. I mean, it’s logical, their work was done, right?
History will not be kind to either Netanyahu, or the Biden/Trump presidencies.
This will mean fuck all the to Palestinians who became “displaced persons” just so the Israeli’s can have their own Lebensraum.
The rest of the world needs to get off its ass and ensure Gaza is rebuilt on Israel’s shekel for the Palestinians like a modern day Marshall plan. And ideally prosecute a couple of people for actively advancing genocide.
This will mean fuck all the to Palestinians who became “displaced persons” just so the Israeli’s can have their own Lebensraum.
Does Lebensraum mean to have the safety of not to get attacked by your neighbors? I’m not justifying this plan but to say that was Israel wanted this all along when they disengaged in 2005 and didn’t start the war is a bit out there
An awful lot can change in twenty years.
What has happened in the last twenty years
This is completely fucking shocking. I hope all the Uncommitted folks are proud of themselves.
I’m sorry, but were the democrats stopping the thing?
Stop framing this like this is on the people who didn’t want the genocide to happen. It’s such a weird victory lap I see people here taking. Without fail.
News: something horrible has happened in Gaza.
a bunch of people on lemmy: I was so right.
You’re reading news about people being ethnically cleansed and you’re patting yourselves on the back. What in the fuck.
The establishment US and the ownership class are all-in on this genocide. We are exactly where we would’ve been if Kamala had won. They all support Israel. The democrats just had to do some surface level finger wagging because they knew they were relying on the votes of a bunch of people who see how genocide for what it is. They were lying to you and you’re acting like Israel and the Palestinians aren’t on the same exact path they would’ve been had Kamala won.
You all are sick for taking these horrible stories as some kind of victory. The ownership class is pitting you against republicans, and you against the people who didnt vote exactly like you did in an election. And why was that? Because the people you voted for were enabling a fucking genocide.
As was said elsewhere, history won’t be kind to Biden, trump, Kamala, and Netanyahu. But it won’t be kind to the people who were looking the other way to vote for the enablers.
We were handed a shit sandwich. We all had zero good choices. So some people decided they couldn’t bring themselves to vote for enablers of genocide. That isn’t an incorrect decision. Stop fighting the people who—I mean, I’m assuming(?) you don’t support the genocide…—want to see the genocide end. Because what could you possibly be getting out of that but all these back pats you’re giving yourself?
Choice was the status quo and pushing towards a solution or palestines almost immediate erasure to violent cheers. Nothing to do with being ‘right’, about hoping yous aren’t completely cooked and see sense. Just as far gone as MAGA unfortunately.
“My candidate was the right choice and you’re wrong. You’re basically maga.”
You have to see how insane that is.
I’m not saying trump isn’t worse. I’m saying if you people cared about the genocide, you wouldn’t be trying to throw anti-genocide people under the bus. You just wouldn’t. You would be working with them toward a solution.
The other powerless people aren’t your enemy. The ownership class that is committing and profiting off this genocide is. But you all are taking aim at the underclass because it gives you a high horse to ride.
That is wrong. That’s my point. But you all just doubled down in the face of that sentiment.
I’m an anarchist dumbass I can just see the reality. Yous are as gone as maga. Victims of propaganda and acting against your own (and the palestines interests).
You aren’t anti-genocide. As we told you before the election, your outcome of your stance is pro genocide. And now the Palestinians have to pay the price for your stupidity.
By your logic if the democrats had won and the genocide had continued (which it absolutely would have) then you’d be pro genocide for voting democrat.
No that is your logic. You’d be pro-supporting-the-lesser-genocide. There’s no lesser option that is available beyond your choice. There is for someone who abstained, so their position actively supported exacerbating the genocide.
There are options that aren’t just voting you lazy ass coward.
Oh fuck off. Kamala wouldn’t have been cheering for ethnic cleansing.
If you have two choices and one is less bad, you choose the less bad one.
Nah, she would have just continued to do it quietly, just like Biden did. You people are fucking monsters man. Absolutely no sympathy for the Palestinian people.
And not murdering our country and doing permanent long term damage…I’ll take the trade and hope people can work against it. Noone is going against it now. Morons.
Nobody was going against it before. What don’t you guys understand about this?
It wasn’t an issue at the top of the list of concerns. There were more important things. Single-issue bullshit.
That single issue is genocide you nazi fuck.
80% of Israelis support ethnic cleansing of Gaza. If they actually attempt it, what makes you think Biden/Kamala would have tried to stop it?
I think the only difference is that Trump would cheer on the cleansing while Kamala would have tut tutted about it.
Kamala isn’t dead. She hasn’t fallen off the face of the Earth. Has she released any statement even now condemning the idea? She doesn’t even have to fear AIPAC anymore. She has nothing to lose in condemning the idea. If she won’t even release a statement condemning it now, what makes you think she would have lifted a finger to prevent it if she had been elected?
That was the whole point of the uncommitted movement. The only difference between Trump and Kamala’s Israel policy is that Trump vocally supports war crimes, while Kamala quietly supports them.
Ooh, a statement. Well that’s all she, or anyone else who supports Palestinians getting to stay alive and in their homes can do now. Everything we’re discussing on this thread has become pointless, because the side that wants Israel to take both Gaza and the West Bank and violently remove all the residents there now controls all branches of the federal government. It’s gonna happen, and we’ve run out of ways to stop it after this last election. You may as well demand your pet cat make a statement, it will have as much effect.
Ooh, a statement. Well that’s all she, or anyone else who supports Palestinians getting to stay alive and in their homes can do now.
What was she doing while running for president? She couldn’t give a proper statement even then, just weasel words that clearly still showed support for israel. Words are all democrats ever have while they continue to kneel to the oligarchy (or be part of the oligarchy themselves).
the side that wants Israel to take both Gaza and the West Bank and violently remove all the residents there
Funny that you think this sentiment is contained to only one of the two major parties in the US. Their actions speak otherwise.
Your vote is the only power you have. That means you should use it as effectively as possible. Which means you shouldn’t only use it on the ideologically pure, you also use it for people who are more in that direction than the alternative.
The result of this last election is someone who supports a Palestinian state lost, and someone who supports total Israeli domination won. Your takeaway that something else happened is rare and is not the takeaway of the media, the voters, or the parties. Palestine is now dead in American politics and support for Palestine in any form will now be seen as a liability, that is if any Palestinians are left after this term. Don’t shoot the messenger.
Your mistake is in thinking the parties are different in any meaningful way when it comes to israel. Our votes are powerless in the face of lobbying: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlKmWa8p4UM
